Other ideas for the Harbor Square property
By Eric Livingston
During the Dec. 18 public hearing at the Edmonds City Council meeting, Councilmember Lora Petso invited the public to send ideas to the council regarding Harbor Square.
I’ve given a bit of thought to this challenge, and while there hasn’t been time enough to research and develop a set of financials to see if these ideas may or may not work; I think they may have some conceptual value.
A bowling alley, maybe Robin Hood Lanes could relocate to a Harbor Square. It did OK for 60 years where it was; it just might do OK for another 60 years in the Harbor Square area if given the chance.
Maybe an ice rink could work there. After all Rosalynn Sumners – World Champion and Olympic silver medalist figure skater – is from Edmonds. Future figure skating champions just might get their start there. Also, pee wee through junior hockey leagues could develop at that location. The Ice Capades could come and preform on a regular basis. I’d like to think that the folks in Kingston and other locals on the peninsula would grab the ferry to come and see the show. Maybe even have a meal or two.
The American Brewing Company might have some tourist value and – forgive the pun – add some flavor to the waterfront.
While this next idea might upset a few folks, an additional movie theater with two or three screens could help bring people to the area.
The theory is if one can develop a gathering place that gives people both a reason and some activity while at that location, all other businesses – including the proposed businesses at the Antique Mall area – should benefit.
As for the trains that rumble by there, (12,000 or more times annually), if the city would complete getting a “Railroad Quiet Zone” — they did start the process some years back — that would greatly benefit all who want to do business on the waterfront, as well as people who want to be there.
These are just ideas. The point of which is that there are opportunities, many unexplored opportunities, that will be lost if the process stops with just the one idea that is currently before the City Council. But the exploration of other opportunities requires imagination, lots of imagination, and loads of hard work.
Whatever gets developed at the Harbor Square site, it really has to be a concept that adds real value to the people coming to play in Edmonds, and enrich the people who already live here.
Right on, Eric! That is exactly the type of activities Edmonds needs to foster and also what the Citizens Economic Development Committee was recommending… but the city seems to be stuck in the mode of (empty) storefront below loads of apartments or condo on top, a formula which has proven to not work other than enriching the developers. Mr. Yammamoto when he lead the ECDC had also wonderful ideas about bringing different sports arena’s with ball fields, tournaments etc…that would ensue etc.. The point is that each kid participating will bring parents and siblings and all need a place to stay, eat, get entertained, etc…and then go home.
Wouldn’t it be wonderful if the owners and developers would begin to think more like Eric and with far less tunnel vision on new gambits to raise building heights?
The best – VALUE – not the most $$$ . . .
give it back to mother nature!
put in raised walkways so children of all ages can watch the plants and critters.
i keep hearing from local Native Americans, you can learn whatever you need to learn – from nature.
we currently have a couple of really nice “wooded areas” sans 4-legged carnivores.
it’d be great to feel the difference between those, and a marshy area by the sound – especially if it’s connected to the sound!
The economic reality of Edmonds prevails. Retailers locate on the basis of population within a specified radius and/or based on thru traffic. The 1,2 or 5 mile population radius for downtown gets a big zero on 50% of the population circle- no population from Puget Sound. Other than limited ferry traffic, and unlike a similiar geographical located cities like Kirkland- there is no thru traffic in downtown Edmonds. On a sub regional basis, Edmonds can only thrive from a retail standpoint by creating destination retail- similar to how the maltby cafe works in maltby, or by increasing the population in the core area. Given the current retail vacancies in downtown, it seems to me a better plan to push the residential feature on the port property and limit the retail to very limited services or square footage. A new theater probably will result in the demise of the Edmonds theater- not a good byproduct of a redevelopment. And how much spin off retail from an ice rink or bowling alley?
Eric:
“These are just ideas. The point of which is that there are opportunities, many unexplored opportunities, that will be lost if the process stops with just the one idea that is currently before the City Council. But the exploration of other opportunities requires imagination, lots of imagination, and loads of hard work.” Obviously you did not recognize that the preceding statement of yours is very insulting to the numerous elected officials, city and Port staff, as well as the dozens of citizens who have worked on this issue for several years. If you had researched their work you would not have written your letter.
Mike Echelbarger has already written about the impracticability of your suggestions, which are also some of the reasons those uses, and others, are not being proposed. I’d like to specifically address your bowling alley suggestion. Robin Hood Lanes is going out of business because it does not have a viable business model. Over the years it has only been profitable because the land was leased for an amount substantially below market rates. Unfortunately, land has generally become too expensive to be used for bowling alleys in the Puget Sound area.
Mr. Echelbarger, my gut feeling about your comments, is that you just might be looking at the situation through the wrong end of the telescope.
Let’s take your premise that Edmonds can only survive – “from a retail standpoint” – by creating a retail destination point. Is it possible that the corporation that purchased the ‘Antique Mall’ mall property and presented a plan (via the artist’s rendering on the tiny bill board at the corner of 104 and Dayton), to develop an organic grocery store, a small bistro and a couple of other retail spaces, COULD BE THAT retail destination point from which ‘spin off’ retail develops? Also, couldn’t that theoretical spin off benefit “a” bowling alley or ice rink or both as well as other retail?
Continuing Edmonds survival “from a retail standpoint”, the economic back bone of Edmonds isn’t in the downtown core, but the Route 99 corridor and Stevens Hospital areas. With that piece of information in mind, I find myself asking: why did the Echelbarger Company purchase a failed grocery store property turned antique mall?
If the purchase of the “Old Safeway” property was in anticipation of the building of 300 to 340 condos; is that increase in population of the core area by 500 to 700 people, enough of a customer base to have a profitable organic grocery store?; especially when you consider the hugely popular organic grocery PCC store 2 miles away.
By the way, the PCC occupies a failed Albertson’s grocery store and is next to a 60 year old bowling alley.
Add to those observations, the fact that most of my retail dollars (not to mention my time) and half of my movie theater dollars are spent in the Alderwood Mall area and not in Edmonds. Yes, it would be disastrous to have the Edmonds Theater close.
Unless you know something I don’t, adding population to the “core area” is – sadly – highly unlikely to give me the opportunity to change that pattern.
While I appreciate spirit of creativity behind the writers ideas, I think they are more than a bit myopic.
First, it’s important to recognize outside of providing space for the existing anchor tenants (Harbor Square Athletic & Harbor Square Inn), the plans for development have not been specific on what businesses should be located in the redeveloped area. Any business with the need for the type of space desired can lease the space.
Second, as popular as ice skating and bowling may be, neither are major activities in Edmonds or elsewhere. Our local bowling alley can’t afford it’s own land in a much less expensive area of Edmonds (though I certainly hope they can find a new location). As for ice rinks, I can’t profess to be an expert, but based on frequently driving by the rinks in Shoreline and Lynnwood – they seem healthy but not the sort of thriving business able afford the amount of real estate they’d need to operate in an expensive areas. To encourage them to use this waterfront area would require the City of Edmonds and the Port to effectively subsidize their operations – which I’m not sure is what we need or want government doing.
Perhaps, we should respect the work of the experts and our own citizens who’ve worked for years to craft a plan for the ‘highest and best use’ for the city and it’s citizens. Unfortunately, without the courage to move forward with this preliminary plan, Harbor Square will ultimately look the same 10 years from now. We should approve the preliminary plan and then mold it with an actual developer over the next five years to best fit our city.
Mr Livingston, For the record I am a resident of Edmonds but NOT the owner of the old safeway property
The massive towering new 5 story 50 Pine Street building across from Point Edwards should be modified to be compatible with the nine existing Point Edwards community. It does not conform to 20.10 E. of the ECDC which states: “To minimize incompatible and unsightly surroundings and visible blight which prevent orderly community development and reduce community property values. (Ord.3636 P.1, 2007.” Furthermore, such a 5 story new building would open the doors for similar height buildings which are especially objectionable when build on a bluff.
i’ve been thinking . . .
How about letting the First People use the land?
Some kind of educational development that could be used year round…
and, something i’ve yet to see or hear about anywhere . . .
a restaurant – featuring First People’s food and herbs . . .
enjoy the fresh foods of the seasons and how to prepare them
Obviously the food would be seasonal, and support local businesses
If First People took over the property it would make a great location for a casino. Likely the revenue to the city would improve as compared with condos or apartments. The revenue opportunity for First People would like be better as a casino vs s resturant or a form of a farmers market.